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CHF 4.1
Web-GhostDate: Monday, 27-Aug-2018, 6:32 AM | Message # 31
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For every new patch, our bot stops working properly and now we don't have much of a bot 24/7 support most of the support forums are gone or inactive
so its just me bond korodie and khan

Also to note we did not make the bot software nor we can make our own bot software... so it takes a while to troubleshoot it new errors

Quote RosarioVampireZ ()
The 1.30 patches (from 1.29 tbh) seem to be made by 40 percent 4v4 bnet players. RIP wc3 solo scene cause of that.

i still think 1.26 is better 
since everything was working (bot map etc)


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t33vs1erDate: Tuesday, 28-Aug-2018, 9:30 AM | Message # 32
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For everyone's info: 

The bug that DC is not related to the bot itself, but to the game. I watched a CHF replay yesterday (i.e. offline) and it crashed. 

-Teevz

Added (28-Aug-2018, 9:39 AM)
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I tried version 4.1 with Dooms. today. I really appreciate the work Bond is putting into this game. I also like the idea of new spells and ulti. I however will not play CHF 4.1. The reason being is due to these changes:

- Newts = 3 food
- Golem = 3 food

Etc...

Currently we see AOE and WW/DS every game. I like to play creeps. That is my playing style. Now this cannot be done without me stacking hardcore each game - which not only will be unfair to other players, but won't always be possible. 

Sure I can join the AOE bangwagon, but I really liked the micro part of footy. It is a strategy too.

With version 4.1 we will see only mass AOE... EACH and EVERY single game. 

Creeps imbalanced? Sure when you have 3 levels above everyone else as a result of a good rush, as well as tons of gold you do become imbalanced. 

But a succesful start would anyhow give you the gold to tome up (making you imba as well) or tech units up and kick bases. 

Having a good rush or mass will give you an advantage. It is not creeps that are imbalanced, but the players or the stacked teams. Most guys I have seen playing creeps and Golems do so when they stack. Stacking will give an advantage, no matter whether you nerf newts and Golems. They will tome up, team up on killing ennemy heros and pool for tech. The problem was never creeps... it was good players being really good (and we cannot blame them for that) or the fact that good players stacked.

Now, the only thing we have done is remove yet another playing style, that we actually see quite rarely these days (and that people have figured out how to counter).

I really do not like version 4.1 in its current state. I hate to say it. I know bond has put a lot of work in it and I appreciate that, but I cannot lie - version 4.1 demotivated me to play CHF in the future (if it is to come out looking like the beta version).

Best,
-TeeVz

Added (28-Aug-2018, 9:45 AM)
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For clarification: In version 4.0 you could with some good early game spells save up gold and make some mercs without having pro allies. This will not be possible in 4.1. This may motivate players to stack more if they golem - it surely would motivate me to do so (which sucks for everyone involved).

 
FirNesSDate: Tuesday, 28-Aug-2018, 3:49 PM | Message # 33
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The thing you don't understand is that creeps are way too overpowered because they are so hardly counterable. Golem, nexts, turtle are all very tanky and are impossible to kill unless you get at least lvl 10. But if someone knows how to micro properly, no one should get lvl 10 in the game.
Having more food for each unit doesn't mean you can't micro anymore, it just means you have to upgrade base to get a full micro team, which is the point. It forces you to spend more gold, enables people to challenge you a bit more and somehow balances the game. If we do not touch the food cost of creeps, then we should really make them squishier. Honestly newt & golems are unkillable, even with bladestorm. U need lvl 11 to charm golems but you can't get lvl 11 if you play charm vs a golemer lol

Anyway about stacking etc, i really think that all chf games should be -pool off, it would solve a ton of problems. And if Bond really does that, then we could think about not nerfing the creeps too much. But still slightly. 
I mean cmon, you are not being objective, you're trying to defend creeps just cuz u like using them. And it's very understandable, it's true that full aoe WW games are boring. What can I say? People ain't creative enough

Added (28-Aug-2018, 3:51 PM)
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anyway if bond has to work on the game every time blizzard releases a new patch we'll never see 4.1 online


 
t33vs1erDate: Tuesday, 28-Aug-2018, 4:45 PM | Message # 34
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Well I get what you are saying, but the current state of CHF is "mass aoe" all over the place with wind walk. The issue is not merc creeps and players who micro. Go online and play a few games, and count how many players you see playing mercs. Very few. You may see DooMs, myself and perhaps a few other old schoolers who drop by occasionally. Mercs is not the primary issue - few people play it. The issue however is people constantly picking  carrion, nova, fork lightning, chain lighting, wind walk and divine shield - EVERY SINGLE GAME

I get your point that players have to tech, but in order to get the current 10/10 creep army (from 4.0) in 4.1 you have to tech TWICE. That's 2500 gold right there. That's quite a bit. You will get your creep army set up much later. Everybody who plays creeps knows that in most games (unless you play pub games, in which you would win ANYWAY whether you micro or not) you have to win within 15 (latest 20 min). After that, ennemy's get teched units, high level HK's and AOE. Have fun going micro against that!

Golems falls apart quickly - when ennemy reaches level 11 AOE and HK, they kind of do well against creeps. Additionally, once enemy reaches t2 with tons of upgrades or t3, creeps are also countered.

And here I have not mentioned all the other counters - to list a few:
- Yamato canon level 2 instant kills a golem
- Torental Tribute also instant kill golems
- Mind rape golem and staff them back to your bass (I used to do that a lot against micro players back then)
- Turtle
- Lizard
- Explosion!
- Teching
- Newts
- Catapults
- HK and focusing the hero of the microing player
- Charm - duh!
- Transmute kinda counters it - vs wizard and priest.
- Chimera
- Bash Bear
- Mass summons isnt really a counter but is annoying

Not only that... high level aoe and HK spells also counters newts and can easily kill heros.

Agait, point is: if bond wants to have old players coming back, removing the option to play creeps is not really the way. By removing one of the ways to play is not the way to make the game inactive. Microing is a thing of the past and good creep micro players would most games anyway without microing creeps. Only thing is, you will be removing a key dimension of the game - a whole playstyle!

I am fine with some tweeeks on certain creeps, such as the newts being a too tanky. But beside that, I don't really see this as a good call.

Added (28-Aug-2018, 4:49 PM)
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I forgot to mention -  donation played smartly also counters Golems and creeps. You will see a lot of donation these days. Most good players now play donation, HK or AOE. You rarely see Golems. Why nerf that. Additionally, people are figuring out how to counter them, and people who do not play golems usually think it is easy to win with them. No, because getting set up, getting high level, rushing, buying them, getting the gold... that's the hard part.

That is... unless you are stacking... but then again the problem is stacking and pooling, not the golem play.

 
i-connectDate: Wednesday, 05-Sep-2018, 0:54 AM | Message # 35
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Sup bond, I’m down to play 4.1 once you finally release it. I don’t even play chf anymore lmao
 
FirNesSDate: Wednesday, 05-Sep-2018, 4:24 AM | Message # 36
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the bot is down for now

 
Bond009Date: Sunday, 09-Sep-2018, 11:33 PM | Message # 37
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How are things going in CHF? i have been busy for a week or so but plan to get back into things again soon. Also kind of waiting for Blizzard to figure out their shit.. lol

Looks like things should be improving
https://us.battle.net/forums/en/bnet/topic/20768926757
https://us.battle.net/forums/en/bnet/topic/20767579541

Also we were able to get the bot going good again with the redirects too.


 
FirNesSDate: Monday, 10-Sep-2018, 4:11 AM | Message # 38
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Ty for the bot. I'll try this out, cuz before bot went down quite many games were crashing.

 
t33vs1erDate: Monday, 10-Sep-2018, 8:33 AM | Message # 39
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Quote Bond009 ()
Also we were able to get the bot going good again with the redirects too.

Good stuff. I feel a second donation is around the corner smile
 
b3pDate: Monday, 10-Sep-2018, 9:11 AM | Message # 40
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I can give u free war3 if u want to come back play  biggrin

 
t33vs1erDate: Monday, 10-Sep-2018, 5:03 PM | Message # 41
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Quote b3p ()
I can give u free war3 if u want to come back play
 
Hey. I actually was in your clan back then (ROD). Good times.
 
FirNesSDate: Tuesday, 11-Sep-2018, 5:30 AM | Message # 42
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Well. Bot works, but sometimes wc3 crashes... my mate just got dced and me too 10 mins later

 
ic3dt3aDate: Wednesday, 12-Sep-2018, 12:06 PM | Message # 43
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Quote t33vs1er ()
- Newts = 3 food- Golem = 3 food


i've not yet played the latest version but this was too much of a nerf, bond

to balance the newt, you could either split into 2 different types(not sure if anyone else used the dispel as much as i did) and make the net newt's armor be light or none.

lets take a look at what makes the golems good:

stun
chaos damage
building armor
magic resistance

removing 1 or 2 of these would balance them. you could either replace them with another minion with stun and magic resistance WITHOUT the building armor as this requires you to buy the turtle or lizards to eat them. its too pricey and a simple counter for the golems SHOULD be teching. what i used to do is select my skills depending on who i was playing against. for a hardcore golem player, serpent wards were really useful along with teching. the problem then(maybe still ongoing?) was ppl smurfing cause they were shitty players. BUT, a counter to a mercenary shouldnt have to be taken during skill selection, it should be available anytime. the easiest counter of course is teching, but due to the armor, this makes it much difficult and just makes the golems a good point to aoe as units will be attacking. ofcourse, t3-5 have no problems with these creeps, but by then it is too late.

edit: just played a quick one, why havent u removed death coil from shaman? this skill was put in SPECIFICALLY to counter halpmeh in wfe's version. it should have NEVER stayed in custom footies.


http://chf.ucoz.com/forum/71-3499-61942-16-1396993348

Message edited by ic3dt3a - Wednesday, 12-Sep-2018, 12:13 PM
 
Adam_CZDate: Thursday, 13-Sep-2018, 10:45 AM | Message # 44
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Where I can download 4.1?
 
FirNesSDate: Friday, 14-Sep-2018, 12:10 PM | Message # 45
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The bot is off again Bond, there's been a new wc3 update.

 
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