I agree with cheesey but i go elitians cause it has banshees banshees rape with newts earlu game
irrelevent but... ps. Grunts fully upgraded rapes dark dryads and all tiers from 1 to 4 from all races cause grunts hit like 130 dmg with upgrade magine grunts on aura and scroll.. I rape darks like this when im too poor to buy anything and upgraded attack for my towers in ftd
although pulverize is one of strongest passive, tauren sucks so hard. as I said before because it's movement speed and attack speed are so low. also this big size is one of handicap. these balance should be considered and compared at every condition... not only upgrade situation but also its characteristic(like attack type, armor type, generation rates, unit size, attack range, proper hero builds and etc) 1 vs 1 is pretty meaning less. for example milita can win skel warrior at 1v1. but it doesnt mean mailita is better than skell warrior. because militia have heavy armor while skell warrior is medium. skell warriors are much better at hk, bk part. also on 1v1 tauren pwns mortal team. but if it goes mass unit fight, tauren can't win mortal team
w/e I wanna say that elitian should be Reference.
Night elf is and should be the weakest race against any other tier but give strongest resistance at enemy spells(like aoes)
Human should be the best Hk tiers(because spell breaker have range attack and feedback, knight have bash) but not the best against other tier. So each of tier2, tier3, tier4 requires feedback buff. and change spell breaker armor type to medium.
About undead.. I think giving splash type of attack to tier2, tier3 is the best way.
plus I wanna say that give 100 more Health Point to every tier1, tier2, tier3 units. Also tier4 units should be buffed. All these tier4 units aren't such good than their previous tier(except undead) while it cost 4000 gold And grunt , rifleman gives so much golds when they are dead. this should be fixed. it's only tier1 even they have big hp and good attack damage, it's only tier1.
Rest in Peace Rookies
Message edited by soundwave - Wednesday, 27-Jul-2011, 1:40 PM
About undead.. I think giving splash type of attack to tier2, tier3 is the best way.
Like that will honestly do something and get them recognition... Their physical damage needs to be the best of all other races physical damage. (Since crypts and ghouls have insane physical damage compared to the rest it should follow up all the way to darks) This witth their attack speed will make them fair but not op simply because they cannot uprgrade hp
Quote (soundwave)
tauren sucks so hard
What kind of shrooms u been eating? because I wanna talk to your dealer. For ur tauren idea your pretty much suggesting taurens to be the most op unit ever, most hp and speed. Not op at all... everything about the tauren is great (besides the speed and thats for a fucking reason...) and you wanna remove like the only negative aspect of taurens. It would be neat but really overpowered.
Quote (soundwave)
And grunt , rifleman gives so much golds when they are dead. this should be fixed. it's only tier1 even they have big hp and good attack damage, it's only tier1.
You make these two sound like a great tier 1 choice but theres a reason why banshees are prefered than these 2 xD.
Orcs and humans are best tier the only reason y people prefer elintian because they are ranged. The only shit thing id say about orc is either it needs even more hp as a race or their tier 2 (bezerkers) need to have normal god dam damage... Piercing is the worst of the worst. Humans well every1 underrates the best for some reason.
I hate this n***a actin like jesus - SOUNDWAVES
You don't are pro - Adam_CZ
Message edited by Cheesy-Gordia - Wednesday, 27-Jul-2011, 10:28 PM
I still think that each race should have their own advantages and disadvantages, as long as they are all evened up "It's not how many hours you put into it, but what you put into the hours."-Micheal Jordan "Be the change you wish to seek in the world"-Ghandi
Their physical damage needs to be the best of all other races physical damage.
tier3 has the fastest generation rate and they can upgrade attack speed. also they have frenzy. even with this current low damage if you lead game, bk isnt that hard. The fastest generation rates with fastest attack speed units requiring the highest attack damage??? your idea gonna be completely break balance. This joke isnt funny at all. but true, little bit attack damage gonna be helpful to this race. but its same to every race
Quote (Cheesy-Gordia)
I wanna talk to your dealer. For ur tauren idea your pretty much suggesting taurens to be the most op unit ever, most hp and speed.
when you awake from weed, wash your face and read my post again. there is no suggestion about speed. only hp
Quote (Cheesy-Gordia)
Orcs and humans are best tier the only reason y people prefer elintian because they are ranged. The only shit thing id say about orc is either it needs even more hp as a race or their tier 2 (bezerkers) need to have normal god dam damage... Piercing is the worst of the worst. Humans well every1 underrates the best for some reason.
I don't know what is your reference of the best. but if your reference of "best" is came from tier vs tier, then human isn't best race. Human can't win Orc(except tier2) also orc isn't best. like I said before all these characteristic should be concerned together. also their passive ability too.
Rest in Peace Rookies
Message edited by soundwave - Wednesday, 27-Jul-2011, 10:36 PM
s I said before because it's movement speed and attack speed are so low.
When you say something sucks, and than say as to why, you probably want that fixed :p. Im saying if they could attack faster (they have the bezerk ability) their gonna be unstopabble. There is a reason as to why they attk slow and move slower than ll other techs and its cuz the pulverize which does 250-300 if I recalled
Why I say or my opinion of humans being the best is a)Great armor, b) their rifles arent so bad either, c) Spellbreakers are like ranged skellies, d) The knights are ape shit strong, e) Their darks attack real fast and have 35% bash. That is perma stun pre much to every unit it faces making it a survivalist of a unit.
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The fastest generation rates with fastest attack speed units requiring the highest attack damage??? your idea gonna be completely break balance. This joke isnt funny at all.
Your forgetting the fact skellys have like 525 hp only. Its armor type is also poo. When something on 1 side is real good, something on another side needs to be real shit. You even mentioned somewhere of nightelf needing magic resistance but be defenseless too physical damage and I agree with that. If 1 sides real good, another side gotta suck. Undead, shit hp but high damage I don't see the unbalance. Idk maybe the skelly mages should get the least effect of the high damage aspect, but the rest man it needs it ,it does.
And bond just a suggestion, give bezerkers normal damage not piercing, because when I played them b4 man holy crap they were garbage because peircing is weak vs like all armor types. They are over the line useless
I hate this n***a actin like jesus - SOUNDWAVES
You don't are pro - Adam_CZ
Message edited by Cheesy-Gordia - Wednesday, 27-Jul-2011, 10:54 PM
BTW tier1, tier2, tier3 are really important, ESPECIALLY TIER1 and TIER2.
when you use units or tech build, these two TIER can decide game.
for now, elitian and human tier1, 2 are too good then anyother race. also these two races tier3 are better than anyother race tier3(talon, skell mages) this is why ppl uses only elitian and human. also this is why balancing tech is requiring. I don't want Race Standardization. This isn't balancing. Like dragonwarrior said
Quote (DragonWarrior)
race should have their own advantages and disadvantages
But above all things, AOEs should be Nerfed or these all tech should be buffed. HERO WITH AOES can fuck every tier.
When you say something sucks, and than say as to why, you probably want that fixed :p.
true but it doesn't applying at every situation. Just wanted show current weakness but I suggested buff at different part. like HP, splash attack type and etc
Quote (Cheesy-Gordia)
Your forgetting the fact skellys have like 525 hp only. Its armor type is also poo. When something on 1 side is real good, something on another side needs to be real shit. You even mentioned somewhere of nightelf needing magic resistance but be defenseless too physical damage and I agree with that. If 1 sides real good, another side gotta suck. Undead, shit hp but high damage I don't see the unbalance. Idk maybe the skelly mages should get the least effect of the high damage aspect, but the rest man it needs it ,it does.
you are right (but its 550hp whatever). but we can buff other parts. my splash attack type idea came from disease cloud. This abomination passive can fuck every tier. also their stomp ability can reduce chance of every melee units ability like bash or pulverize. So what if tier2, tier3 have splash damage. this undead race can be completely best race at messing up other tiers but not best at BASE KILL and HERO KILL.
Rest in Peace Rookies
Message edited by soundwave - Wednesday, 27-Jul-2011, 11:19 PM
Humans. (Hmmm, you know I don't really know. Uhhhh, ya humans are op lol)
Rifles: Their fine, 505 hp, 18-20 damage and medium armor. This is good and has a pretty slow attack rate. This is balanced
Militia: Their armour is good, their attack isnt too strong. Their balanced
Spellbreakers : Like ranged skellies pre much but very vulnerable too armor reducing shit. Their balanced.
Knights: Probably the tier I hate the most of humans, buuuut they got some good armor, dec attack and dec speed. They are balanced because their spawn rate holy shit slow.
Dark knights: Their op lol. I can't find nothing negative about em. Great attack rate and they got 35% bash. SOMETIN WRONG HIA ^^. NERF
Undead: (Vulnerable too spells but amazing damage, and needs more damage, they deserve to be the hit hard race)
Ghouls: Do a shit ton of damage and got heavy armor but are very vulnerable too spells. Balanced
Crypts : Their spawn rate isn't bad, High damaged, ranged, however they got piercing. But these guys are too weak. Medium armor and piercing damage in one. j33bus christ. BUFF BUFF BUFF.
Mages: They got as much hp as rifles or near as much atleast. Great attack speed, but man piercxing damage + shit physical damage? is this a joke??. BUFF BUFF BUFF BUFF BUFF.
tier 4: Aboms. Now they got alot of default hp and attack pre good. Idk about you guys as weird as it may sound I think aboms are balanced. (Idk armor type however so tell me)
Dark aboms: Uhh buff up their poison gas thing because as of I recalled its garbage and theres no point into them having it. Buff the cloud.
Night elves: (Bad hp, pre dec attack but all ranged)
Archers : Horrible in every way lol. Buff something...
Huntresses: Some decent hp, decent damage and armor and range. These guys are dec. Balanced.
Druid: These guys with upgrades are tank as tits. I think these guys are good
Dryads: No comment their good.
Dark dryads: No coment their balanced.
However all of nightelf should have 25-33% magic immune to their units.
Orcs:(Survival skills but slow turds)
Very very tank, but not tank enough... Give them more hp to start with. Also give bezerkers normal damage because they are the worst tier 2 unit ever. Light armor and piercing damage. What a joke.
Grunts: Most hp, good armor and attack. But slow as their negative side. Balanced
Bezerkers: I think its self evident that they need a BUFF.
Raiders: Near same as kodos but they are actually better than kodos. They are balanced
Taurens: I think these guys have abit too much negative, slow everything, attack, movement and spawn rate. But when these guys are upgraded, its fucking gg on the spot man. So it would be fine either leaving them the way they are orrr buffing something about these guys.
Dark tauren: These guys attack SOOOOOOOO fast, great hp (could use abit more :D) and the pulverize with their attack speed. Hot dam. However tthey move soo slooooow >.< fucking cows... anhyways their balanced. If you wanna however put more hp on them go ahead.
Elintian: No comment everyone seems to enjoy them and all the tiers for it. But the mortars having automatic devotion aura is a bit bullshit I mean their good where they are now, so why have that crap.
Banshees: Their dps is best for tier 1, but vulnerable to spells. Balanced
Skellies: Debate between militia and skellies being better, militia is better simply cuz they have better armor and pre much same statistics as skellies. Anywho, skellies are great because they have the orc special, their armor is the bad factor. Skellies however are abit too op simply cuz they move pretty fast when they shouldnt. A little nerf
Kodos: Raiders are better... anywho lol, they are fine. As weird as that sounds, if kodos were gonna get nerfed, raiders would need one too.
Mortars: Man take that bullshit devotion aura from them, they are too op for tier 4. Nerf
Dark mortars: Too op man, their like ranged orcs with frenzy and auto devotion. Nerf
MOST OF THIS IS FACT, BUT SOME OF IT IS OPINION SO DON'T 100% RELY ON THIS THE FIRST TIME YOU READ IT.
I hate this n***a actin like jesus - SOUNDWAVES
You don't are pro - Adam_CZ
Message edited by Cheesy-Gordia - Wednesday, 27-Jul-2011, 11:22 PM
no offense but cheesy wasn't good tech player. And I haven't seen him using tech or w/e without pro player support.
here are my list of units that should be fixed. And nerf of AOE mana costing amount should be premise.
Rifleman - this units gives more than 40 gold when it die. it's only tier1 unit. most of tier3 unit gives only 20~30. compensation of killing one rifle should be reduced to like 35~20
spell breaker - 1 kodo or 1 raider should be compared with 2 spell breaker. because of its generation rate. so armor type should be back to medium. but feedback damage needs little bit buff for hero kill(like 5~7). for now spell breaker is better than tier4 knight(same armor type, same attack type, faster generation rate).
tier4 knight - this units ability looks good but it isnt. If you played many game with human tech. You might realize it. To get tier4 knight at least you needs 8350 golds (950 + 1400 + 2000 + 4000 gold + cost for upgrade). But these units gonna be easily melt down by acid, nova, swarm, wave and etc. Same for every tier4. but these tier4 units buff should be touched carefuly. Giving more feedback amount and 100 more hp buff or damage buff would be good enough.
Ghouls - this units sucks so hard but hard to touch it. because this ghouls are related with black arrow. So just reduce price of gold when it dies. should be less then 20 and cheapest. So undead tier starter can move away their fear about feeding. it should be units for rush. (Same as black arrow spawning ghoul). If you have played undead ladder 1v1 with ghouls you can imagine. or Zerglings in Starcraft
Fiends - since it doesnt have hp upgrade and low generation rates, armor type should be changed to heavy or unarmor type to resist melee units. If chimera and phoenix had light armor this piercing type attack could be powerful :/ What if fiends have siege type attack with splash damage would it be OP?
Skel MAGE - undead tier 3 is just feed generator. change their armor type to unarmor and give them splash. so at least they can mess up other tier. while they have weakness at AOES. From my suggetion, this UNDEAD TECH IS OPPOSITE FROM NIGHT ELF TECH.
Grunt - same as rifleman.
Head hunter - for sure these units required buff but idk. If grunt and head hunter have pillage ability then it can be helpful for this ORC tech.
Raider - this have almost same ability with kodo, actually better than kodo. But tier1, tier2 sucks so hard. If 2 player starts tech same time (one start orc, the other start elitian) then I am sure elitian tech user gets much more advantage and money. So giving +50~ 100 more HP buff to this unit would be really helpful.
Tauren - You might see these BIG units are melting down while they are on march Give them 100~ 200 more HP buff. but it is the most powerful units with BILL
Wow wow wow homie surely I didn't tech or tier so much don't mean im retarded or clueless of capabilities homie. + Alot of this is from 5.4 experience and I thought of it in the chf perspective now.
Mages cool idea.
The pillaging idea is abit... Ladder man cmon xD... Deoends how much gold can be harvested from each hit. Also will it change each tierm, example: like tier 1, each hit 2 gold, tier 2 each hit 3 gold.
Nothing besides bezerkers has light armour meaning piercing attackers are only good against those armor types. Making fiends shit. They need better damage types man.
I hate this n***a actin like jesus - SOUNDWAVES
You don't are pro - Adam_CZ
Message edited by Cheesy-Gordia - Thursday, 28-Jul-2011, 1:05 PM
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