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New game ender
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| Bond009 | Date: Sunday, 17-Apr-2011, 2:22 PM | Message # 1 |
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| So was thinking theres really no mid-game, game ender.. aside from getting crazy strong units that are like 10x strong than anyone else (which isnt always easy to do) or a mualer getting to lvl 20 faster than anyone else to be able to kill bases. theres really nothing besides (Tanks 900) and a big gap all the way to (Pengs at like 14,500) which has a good length in start stock delay. i'm thinking there needs to be something for mid/semi-late game ender for a price in-between the little tank and the high cost pengs.. was thinking of adding like a super tank, it will have a bit longer start-stock delay then the normal tank also it will have longer restock time than normal tank
it should be probably about 5k-6.5k gold range and be like at least 5x stronger than a normal tank. a lot more hp so it can't be dispelled as fast but on the catch side it wont be a true item.. it will be something u have to move over to the base. this will help so u cant just POOF surprise attack a base and kill it out of nowhere in like 2 sec's (but you can make it invisible) so that will help to sneak it over to another base. it will have a summon duration about as long as pengs. i havent decided on its hp and attack number yet or attack speed but when i think of something that will be somewhat balanced ill update this. i just notice playing in game with all pros sometimes games get to be "boring" ppl say.. and i know why. its because it comes to a point that no one can really do shit aside from sneak around and try to hero kill or every now and then steal some feed from the other base. and you're sitting there with 4-7k collectively as a team and cant really do shit with it. So the game goes on forever stalling time to stack and collect runes for your base so you can do more ballsy things etc till eventually the game can get crazy enough again to where ppl start making some good cash to get pengs or something.
I think this will help put an end to this kinda thing for giving new options with middle of the road gold amounts before games get to be over an hour long so let me know what ya think of it
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| Antyone | Date: Sunday, 17-Apr-2011, 2:25 PM | Message # 2 |
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| 5-6.5k range? 
oh nvm u mean the GOLD range fml idk 6k is quite easy to get some people sit t1 for a very long time and a tank like that from what i understand could finish entire team.
Message edited by Antyone - Sunday, 17-Apr-2011, 2:26 PM |
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| Bond009 | Date: Sunday, 17-Apr-2011, 2:29 PM | Message # 3 |
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| yea thats the reason for the start stock delay, it will be about in the middle of the tank and peng's start stock delay, so its long enough to where u cant just sit around with t0's and save gold for that tank the whole time and think your' gonna be safe.
Thats why pengs start stock delay is as long as it is so give time for ppl to be able to have a chance vs it. theres been times i wish it had less start stock delay but thats part of what helps keep the balance.
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| LittleB | Date: Sunday, 17-Apr-2011, 2:34 PM | Message # 4 |
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| Quote (Bond009) 5x stronger than a normal tank
Well bond, the normal tank with BL can easily pwn bases, imagine a tank like this with BL.
But on the other hand i dont agree with u on having something to end bases quicks, bcus for example, stuff like tanks/pengs. are just wasted if the atked team just uses rune, so it would be waste of 14k ( and yes i know even if rune it can bk bases 0-3 easily , but for stuff like t4 t5.... and to get pengs it gonna be late game and someone will have teched ) anyway a tank like that could be nice, but there should be some other kind of thing, like something that can atk even if they rune, but it doesnt do much damage but at same ttime, quite a little,o idk, and if this tank is like the normal tank, it can be dispelled or killed be arcane/mauler ez.
But ya we totally need something for midgame
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| Bond009 | Date: Sunday, 17-Apr-2011, 5:04 PM | Message # 5 |
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| well i could make it non lust-able and you have to remember the only thing that can lust a tank is the heros ability lust. so someone would have to get that lust with their hero in that case if i made it non lust-able that would i guess make it more balanced as it would be a static attack speed, idk if i would have auras affect it or not either but i guess they could. i would make its attack speed a bit faster than the normal tanks also as normal tanks now dont really have a chance at taking down a t4-t5 base these tanks would have a semi shot at it.. and think of it this way. even if you were about to use pengs.. u could use this tank before hand to make them waste a rune, and then come finish it off with pengs or something.
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| LittleB | Date: Sunday, 17-Apr-2011, 5:22 PM | Message # 6 |
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| Quote (Bond009) come finish it off with pengs or something.
Ya that normally works, but there are ''cowardly pubs'' that from the beginening,right after mass, they start stacking on runes, and steal from other team, and if other team leave, they leave the peasent there to stackon runes x2. but other then that this tank could be nice.
But what i said bout the thing to atk even with rune, think about it for something 
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| Bond009 | Date: Sunday, 17-Apr-2011, 6:01 PM | Message # 7 |
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| u cant attack while a base is rune'd becuz its invulnerable.. nothing can attack something invulnerable
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| Arctty | Date: Sunday, 17-Apr-2011, 6:37 PM | Message # 8 |
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| I disagree with this. People who say that a game of pros gets "boring" are mentally weak and need to be patient. Sometimes u have to out last. Sometimes one team has map control for a long time and there is nothing you can do and you need to wait for an opportunity to get ahead. Penguins aren't even that hard to get IMO. Also if you have 4-7k collectively you can get a 3.5k golem which can pretty much end the game (watch sounds replay) or u can try to get a ward of the gods with a half decent tech. Sometimes you are waiting 10-15 minutes just for one distraction or one hero kill just so you can send your units to bk everyone. Quote (Bond009) i would make its attack speed a bit faster than the normal tanks also as normal tanks now dont really have a chance at taking down a t4-t5 base these tanks would have a semi shot at it. The regular tanks barley have a chance at taking down tier 1 or a team that is prepared with tier 0 as it is. A tank that could kill a t5 base? penguins can barley kill a t5 base with 1 rune. Imagine what it would do to a tier 0, that would be OP. There is a reason I like chims/bears so much. The answer to your "mid game ender" is getting level 6 bears and level 3 chims. You can bk any outer tier 0 base, and waste all thier runes, you can kill arcanes very easily too. Thats why in 3.5 I either go blizz/root/ww/tower or bears/roots/aura/chims because of their bking ability. You use a lot of builds like bolt/nova/chainlight/mindrape, a triple nuke with a regular spell for ur ult. I don't always like to use those builds for their lack of finishing ability because if your hero can't finish the game then you need a pretty strong tech to do it which isn't too hard if you can get 1 or 2 good feeds. Added (2011-04-17, 7:37 PM)
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There are plenty of options in the game to finish at each stage of the game if you experiment with different builds.
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| BikiniandPunani | Date: Sunday, 17-Apr-2011, 7:34 PM | Message # 9 |
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| i agree with arctty 100 percent! there is no need for something like this, i mean we appreciate that ur not just chillin at ur home and smokin ur home grown but are actually thinking of new ideas for chf, but no bond!!!! this isnt much of a good idea! for many reasons which arctty said most!... there are tons of ways to get wins early and lot of ways to do it! what this will do is make rookies happy as now all they will do is pray to God that the tank makes it to the pros base and cross their fingers so that it bks!!! a true player doesnt really on these things, so simply play and tech if u wanna win fast... or mass shammy and use roots!  oops my new build got spoiled!!!  but seriosuly bond, as much as i like u and ur head, this idea that it came up with is not good!  ps. arctty... u owe me a rep biatch! get on that!!! cheers guys, and if anyone doesnt agree with what i said, tell me 3 good reasons as to why this new iteam would be of any good use! besides cheap bk! which isnt a good reason to start with anyways!
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| lspiderl | Date: Sunday, 17-Apr-2011, 10:04 PM | Message # 10 |
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| Quote (Arctty) There are plenty of options in the game to finish at each stage of the game if you experiment with different builds. i couldnt agree more theres already more than enuff "game enders " at all stages all adding something like this does is make it easier to slightly skilled players to rape newer and causual players till they all jsut stop playin something like this could cost you 1/4th of the player base withing a short time as they all jsut stop playing because they can never win
I suffer from a condition called dislexix disgraphia so please parden my spelling and typographical errors
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| stooge | Date: Sunday, 17-Apr-2011, 11:52 PM | Message # 11 |
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| yea make like a mini penguins, or massive tank...that shit would be cool
If I tell you I am good, You will probably think I am boasting.
If I tell you I am bad, You will Know I am lying.
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| Vexslasher | Date: Monday, 18-Apr-2011, 0:44 AM | Message # 12 |
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| some people all pool for a terror tower at mid game now, I have seen it done, and sometimes it's worth it, and that would be a perfect counter for the super tank probably 2 arc towers would be good enough tho dunno. But it sounds cool I'm sure I would use a super tank, I very rarely get the current tank because it's not good enough to even kill tier one bases if the players are good..
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| Bond009 | Date: Monday, 18-Apr-2011, 2:02 AM | Message # 13 |
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| yea vex gets what im saying, its just tanks use to have a purpose and now doesnt seem like they are worth much unless someone gets b-lust and hits at the perfect time, but eh and i agree with all your statements, its not something really needed.. but if done right and not made at all op, it could be a cool new option.
Quote (Bond009) i would make its attack speed a bit faster than the normal tanks also as normal tanks now dont really have a chance at taking down a t4-t5 base these tanks would have a semi shot at it.
I was thinking along the lines of like this tank being used with also a normal tank and some good tech units rushing in also with all 3 heros making a mess of their base also to take down a t4 (let alone a t5 that would need darks aiding in the attack.)
I mean you see how often pengs fail now a days at taking down a t5 even with some darks helping. this would be a good pre-attack to bluff them to use the rune and so pengs arnt a waste of gold as badly i mean this wouldn't be the solve all thing to ending a game. a rune would protect vs this sham, jammy, newts, heros silence, ice bolts.. etc.. idk give it a little thought i wouldnt make it so good that a skilless attempt at a base with this is a sure success.. it would be like a tank with the power of 4-5 normal tanks in 1 for the gold price of maybe 5-7 tanks
things that would keep the balance would be long start-stock delay like pengs have and long restocks so they cant be stacked up easy. remember their use to not just be pengs of choas but also the pengs of the gods but i took them out to make room for other items and becuz they werent that great anyway i think they were like 8-11k or something. they were good at raping units but not great at taking down buildings.
This could be a little small step to the pengs kinda like the Nuke tower is a small step to the Alter of the gods, and can counter healing ward of the gods. 
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| LittleB | Date: Monday, 18-Apr-2011, 2:05 AM | Message # 14 |
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| Quote (Bond009) u cant attack while a base is rune'd becuz its invulnerable.. nothing can attack something invulnerable
Thats my point, i thought something could atk it, even if its run'd, or something that can dispell it, idk could be neat
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| Bond009 | Date: Monday, 18-Apr-2011, 2:11 AM | Message # 15 |
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| Quote (LittleB) Thats my point, i thought something could atk it, even if its run'd, or something that can dispell it, idk could be neat yea i mean i could make an item or something that could dispel 1 base from having the wards affect.. but that probably isnt a good idea to do and could make things get messy and alot of ppl calling bs. to stuff and raging etc..
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