TBH, I think shamans are fine the way they are. (once the bottom takes place) Actually, I might request another thing...
Please let blank golem, lizzard, newts be charmable at level 2 and change charm for peasant to level 2. If this can happen, it would balance the game in that charm would be used more instead of the current mindrape, tower, talons.
(Why I suggest this: Despite the "cries" that charm is overpowered in theorycraft, let's be legit here, charm SU5KS!. Most games there isn't anything good to charm so by making charm able to counter newts, blank golems, lizzard ult at level 2, people would actually get this "horrible" spell instead of the mass towers I see today. Also, this would make golemmers think twice before golemming)
The part where u can charm newts sounds a little rigged at level 2 ...so level 3? :P
...when i say shamans are fine the way they are...i mean, they are SUPER GOOD but would be less of a pain once charm ult gets balanced :P (btw, why do undead heros have advantage in this game? lol)
The whole point of charm is to counter creeps. If charm in the current form can't even charm half the creeps in the creep shop, what is the point of charm? I would rather get transmute, AKA charm premium.
Message edited by RosarioVampireZ - Wednesday, 22-Jan-2014, 5:48 AM
No point to get charm for now, huge risk, not efficient.Also charm at lvl 1 should work on lizzard, wizzard, priest, Shaman, rock golem, turtle, newt, etc. = works on all things under < 600 gold Would balance a lot CHF game because actually if you rape mass with gay spells like serpt and flame strike you can buy mass creep and win easly without any skills needed. So it could counter that and add also more strategy and game style.
Please let blank golem, lizzard, newts be charmable at level 2 and change charm for peasant to level 2. If this can happen, it would balance the game in that charm would be used more instead of the current mindrape, tower, talons.
(Why I suggest this: Despite the "cries" that charm is overpowered in theorycraft, let's be legit here, charm SU5KS!. Most games there isn't anything good to charm so by making charm able to counter newts, blank golems, lizzard ult at level 2, people would
Point of those creep is to be used in early game lvl 11 will come too late to be usefull + don't forget that if people see you got charm they won't buy creeps and your ulti is useless. Lvl 1 = charm all creeps under 600 g with High CD and mana cost.
1. Make "doom guard" summonable from newt at level 1. 2. Make blank golems be able to be charmed at level 2 (level 1 is too early and it would defeat purpose of having blank golems) 3. Make lizzards charmable at level 2 (if golemmer team has charm and charm works at level 1...that would mean pure bs)
QuoteF00ty_R3b0rn ()
Point of those creep is to be used in early game lvl 11 will come too late to be usefull + don't forget that if people see you got charm they won't buy creeps and your ulti is useless.
But by doing such act, no one would get creeps
QuoteF00ty_R3b0rn ()
Also charm at lvl 1 should work on lizzard, wizzard, priest, Shaman, rock golem, turtle, newt, etc.
Wizzard costs much and for its price early game, it is next to useless. Make wizard level 3 Lizzards, shaman, golem are used early game. By making charm so overpowered against golemming, we are creating another unbalance. Since doom guards are "underused," we should make only doom guards be able to successfully kill a newt at level 1 ult. (Doom guard should also work on turtles from level 2? :P)
Added (22-Jan-2014, 6:22 AM) --------------------------------------------- I believe the point of making charm this strong yet this weak is because I want players to realize that: 1. Charm is a good spell. 2. Charm is extremely risky. Risk comes with good price :P (but if u make charm work from level 1 for blank golems, lizzards, etc., then there wouldn't be as much risk)
Also, btw, peasants should be charmed from level 2. I think its complete bs when d arrow enemy comes and ruins ur peasants (early mass pool d arrow push)
They will buy 1 or 2 creeps then see you got charm and stop to buy another creeps. But this is the whole point of charm = ruins creep And encourage more game style, so instead of using creep they could tech for example.
2. Make blank golems be able to be charmed at level 2 (level 1 is too early and it would defeat purpose of having blank golems)3. Make lizzards charmable at level 2 (if golemmer team has charm and charm works at level 1...that would mean pure bs)
yep I tried to edit my post but failed apparently. Lvl 1 charm -> shaman / priest / goatzilla / rock golem / newt / peons / wizard Lvl 2, 3 -> lizzard / blank / mana dragon
PS wizard won't be weak in next version. If he does the right things. Rock golem charm lvl 1 or 2 is a debeatable since their cost food would be 3 or 4. 4 food would be the best cause it's could even counter the fact that your allies could buy creep for you. Rock golem should be used as support not as main tactic.
By making charm so overpowered against golemming, we are creating another unbalance.
Not really because players aren't dumbass they won't buy creep non stop if you have charm. Current CHF APM ! The Legend is R3b0Rn ! http://imageshack.com/a/img401/3523/vzsc.png
Message edited by F00ty_R3b0rn - Wednesday, 22-Jan-2014, 6:37 AM
Well, I'm gonna keep arguing that shaman and rock golem should be level 2 and that newts can only be stopped by level 1 doom guards
On the flip side, I don't think goatzilla should even be charmed. 1. It costs a lot 2. It does absolutely nothing in game. 3. Its spells dont even work properly and dies easily :/
For peasants, I think charm should be level 2 because of the d arrow rushes. Mass pooling d arrow team with charm at level 1 basically kills game cause enemy cannot repair.
For wizzard, well, unless there is some miracle update, I think it should be charmable at level 3. (level 2 if it gets minor improvements)
Personally, I like to think charm as "race against time" I don't want people to be able to charm golems 2 min after mass ends because then the point of rock golems, shamans become next to useless. I personally think it is unfair that charm level 1 could charm shamans and rock golems since early game, the enemy is pouring EVERYTHING they got for this 1 unit just to realize 30 sec later that it was useless :/ And also, I think level 11 is do-able in a regular game against a golemming team. There is 2 feed teams and if you can't level from them, it is your fault (not really but :P )
Also, newts shouldn't be charmed. No offense but newts is just like... "newts". They are unique creatures that make this game different from other footies [lol]I think doom guard level 1 and up should be the only one able to stop newts since NO ONE absolutely gets doom guards. By making doom guards be more "useful," who knows, maybe doom guards would be used a lot more. Also, I think doom guard level 3 should work on all types of golems (blank and rock)
On the flip side, I don't think goatzilla should even be charmed.1. It costs a lot 2. It does absolutely nothing in game. 3. Its spells dont even work properly and dies easily :/
Lol yeah, but goatzilla isn't a threat^^
QuoteRosarioVampireZ ()
For peasants, I think charm should be level 2 because of the d arrow rushes. Mass pooling d arrow team with charm at level 1 basically kills game cause enemy cannot repair.
Yeah it's debeatable also. To be honest, Don't know what is the best for now
QuoteRosarioVampireZ ()
For wizzard, well, unless there is some miracle update, I think it should be charmable at level 3.(level 2 if it gets minor improvements)
Wizzard should be able to counter DT and also he could fix life steal and mana drain with my values
QuoteRosarioVampireZ ()
I personally think it is unfair that charm level 1 could charm shamans and rock golems since early game, the enemy is pouring EVERYTHING they got for this 1 unit just to realize 30 sec later that it was useless :/
The risk shouldn't be only in 1 sense. After all if you bought charmable creeps it's your fault.
QuoteRosarioVampireZ ()
Also, newts shouldn't be charmed. No offense but newts is just like... "newts". They are unique creatures that make this game different from other footies
Even if newt are nerfed they would still be pretty good (only 375 gold). And anyway not a lot of people are getting charm.
QuoteRosarioVampireZ ()
[lol]I think doom guard level 1 and up should be the only one able to stop newts since NO
Yep that's cool
Also all of this is bond's decisions. So might be sweet if he could gave his point of view Current CHF APM ! The Legend is R3b0Rn ! http://imageshack.com/a/img401/3523/vzsc.png
Message edited by F00ty_R3b0rn - Wednesday, 22-Jan-2014, 6:56 AM
Adam, it's because you don't use properly shamans.For example look this replay : http://www.mediafire.com/downloa....rou.w3g
I got like 25 HK in 15 min. I Killed uncountable times stom, shink and lord and my shaman only died once. This was clavardage
I dont use shamans properly (you didnt see my previous post "i am slow and my micro suck"?) but shamans are weak. Druids or roots and shamans die easy (today i killed 3 shamans with druid level 2 - stun first shaman/cyclone other shaman/then kill other shaman... its not so hard)
your replay is not fair, in my opinion this game was 2v1 (you and Cou "pros and only Roystom "pro") Cyray, Lord and Shinkirou is average (2 pro + 1 average vs 1 pro + 2 average) you win mass easy and they had no chance counter shamans
Adam, it's because you don't use properly shamans. For example look this replay : http://www.mediafire.com/downloa....rou.w3g
is funny a fool deceives
why no remenber the game roystom use horse vs reborn use shaman ??? remember?? AJAJAJAJ
his failure with micro shaman saw her sad I then took out his ogre hero new excuse " my hero no mana " AJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJ you micro is trah omg rebon can not understand it's just poop?
Added (22-Jan-2014, 11:31 AM) --------------------------------------------- psds : you won that game. that my allies took anything . and not teamwork
...when i say shamans are fine the way they are...i mean, they are SUPER GOOD but would be less of a pain once charm ult gets balanced :P (btw, why do undead heros have advantage in this game? lol)
The whole point of charm is to counter creeps. If charm in the current form can't even charm half the creeps in the creep shop, what is the point of charm? I would rather get transmute, AKA charm premium.
this is the way it was:
charm worked on shamans, BUT not on jammy until lvl 11. reason for this was because jammy could dispel black arrow. dark ranger had black arrow and charm, this would have made it an OP as fuck hero that would automatically win. i think transmute also worked on shamans, but requried lvl 2 to get jammy.
...when i say shamans are fine the way they are...i mean, they are SUPER GOOD but would be less of a pain once charm ult gets balanced :P (btw, why do undead heros have advantage in this game? lol)
The whole point of charm is to counter creeps. If charm in the current form can't even charm half the creeps in the creep shop, what is the point of charm? I would rather get transmute, AKA charm premium.
this is the way it was:
charm worked on shamans, BUT not on jammy until lvl 11. reason for this was because jammy could dispel black arrow. dark ranger had black arrow and charm, this would have made it an OP as fuck hero that would automatically win. i think transmute also worked on shamans, but requried lvl 2 to get jammy. http://chf.ucoz.com/forum/71-3499-61942-16-1396993348
No point to get charm for now, huge risk, not efficient.Also charm at lvl 1 should work on lizzard, wizzard, priest, Shaman, rock golem, turtle, newt, etc. = works on all things under < 600 gold Would balance a lot CHF game because actually if you rape mass with gay spells like serpt and flame strike you can buy mass creep and win easly without any skills needed. So it could counter that and add also more strategy and game style.
Then for lvl 2 and lvl 3 reduce mana cost and CD.
That would slay play styles completely. CHF is trying to be flexible remember? Techers. teams. aoes, summons, all to have a perfect equilibrium of force.
QuoteF00ty_R3b0rn ()
I personally think it is unfair that charm level 1 could charm shamans and rock golems since early game, the enemy is pouring EVERYTHING they got for this 1 unit just to realize 30 sec later that it was useless :/The risk shouldn't be only in 1 sense. After all if you bought charmable creeps it's your fault.
Personally kind of a dick thing to say and sounds a little butthurt. But all that aside, 500 gold, 350, whatever for any of these creeps is alot and if an entire playstyle is what it's trying to approach. And if at level 6 (which really is easy to get) can make this
countered by a single ultimate? That would call for overpowered. Unless the cd time is drastically increased.
These all have their own vulnerabilities. Shamans, spells dead. Goat priest wizard same thing. Rock golem is ESPECIALLY very extremely vulnerable to physical damage so no need IMO.
However newts do need a fucking nerf I agree with that completely. They were at first there to counter maulers, but now they are just a shit storm of protection and it's not that easy to kill.
Sure you can cast spells on it, and sure armor is decreased but arguably they are still hard as fuck to kill and easy to replace. Id say either make them very vulnerable to physical or magic damage.
In terms of charm, I think the mana should be dratically decreased for more promotion, shorter cooldown as well. But keep everything where it's at for creeps. Again level 6 is really not hard to get and if you can already just kill an entire playstyle based on one ultimate, kind of overpowered.
Just like that time where I had a problem with the fact that recovering from dtower long time ago was very hard since the splash damage on buildings also hit units (peasants repairing) so it's literally a good game card and it took so much to just recover from a fucking ultimate. Same thing here. If it takes so much to recover from one fucking ultimate, it will be over powered.
I hate this n***a actin like jesus - SOUNDWAVES
You don't are pro - Adam_CZ
Message edited by Cheesy-Gordia - Friday, 31-Jan-2014, 2:08 AM
Why do people keep citing my name for the quote F00ty said
I wanted a difference style for charm... (btw, i modified it a little cause I thought some of my ideas were too rigged :P ) Lvl 1: ehh! Lvl 2: Blank golem, golem, shaman, peasant, jammy Lvl 3: priest, wizzard
Countering newts = Only Doom guard from level 2 :P Maybe doom guard level 3 works on golems and blank golems? o.O
Anyways, whats the point of ults like ressurection? It's CD is super long and its waste of free spell ... lol
Message edited by RosarioVampireZ - Friday, 31-Jan-2014, 4:59 AM
